Originally Posted by MBS

And regarding my comment about "Black women being the least desired in American society"--well aren't they? What was it, 45% of Black women never marry, right? Black women are being ignored by Black men, etc. etc. So what conclusion do we make here?

Originally Posted by 03elleinad

I'm looking for mature conversation that focuses on the underlying reasons why AM/BF may or may not want to date BF/AM. I'm worried about creating a thread on this topic because it has been done to some varying degree throughout AL. In my opinion, most haven't succeeded in addressing why there seems to be a wall preventing BF/AM from getting together. That is not to say that there haven't been excellent responses, but I feel like their over all message just isn't reaching everyone. I guess what I'm looking for is that people - especially AM/BF - not fall back on assumptions, generalizations, stereotypes and whatever else prevents them from pursuing people of the different race.

These are some issues that I think affect potential BF/AM couples:

Preference/Taste - Many people will say they prefer this race or that race. Obviously you're entitled to this. I think, however, that these same people have underlying reasons for this preference that may be founded by other issues. For me, I do not have a very strong interest in white men. There are few that I find attractive, but I'm not interested in dating them. But I must ask myself why. Well, I don't like hairy men, and many white men that I have met are hairy like monkeys. This is a huge turn off to me, so I generally don't even look twice at white guys. Terrible generalization, I know, but I'd prefer just not to date them. On another, deeper note, I also think my issue goes back to perception of slavery in America. White men were allowed to rape black slave women, and I have this fear that that idea is still carried in the mind of many white men, if only unconsciously. Black women are property, jezebels, uncultured creatures who are useful in nothing more than sex in the white man's eye. I do not doubt that this is more than likely ridiculous, but this idea colors how I feel about white men. In recognizing this problem, I can, in time, overcome it.
I feel like most people who prefer one race over another are in the same boat as me, only they don't ask why. I believe wholeheartedly that there is an underlying reason that one may or may not be aware of, or just refuses to acknowledge. I wish, in an effort to be fair, that people would challenge their own preferences/tastes just to be sure that they aren't being unfair to someone else for reasons that person can't control. I think a lot of the things I'm going to bring up here can color your choice to not date an AM or BF. If you are a BF/AM that prefers not to date a AM/BF, ask yourself why. Really ask yourself why.

Environment - In some parts of the world, Asians and Blacks just don't have much interaction. As a result, some Asians and Blacks don't know how to behave around or interact with each other. If they've allowed themselves to believe stereotypes and generalizations, they don't have any vested interest in interacting with each other. I think also that both races are unsure how to act on their attraction for the other, if the attraction is there, of course.
I think the best lesson here is not to make assumptions. I grew up in a very ethnically diverse neighborhood and so associating with Asians was not a big deal to me. When I went to college, I met many people who did not come from diverse areas. I assumed, however, that they did, and would therefore not be uncomfortable with associating with me. Big mistake. I would have approached these people in different ways had I known they may not be used to black people. But at the same time, Asians and Blacks should not assume that they cannot develop relationships (i.e. friendships, associations, etc.) simply because they've never been around the other before. If we are to bridge the gap, we must take steps. Doing nothing yields nothing. If you're okay with that, why are you reading my blog?

Past Experiences - I think both Asians and Blacks can say they've had bad experiences with the other race. To deny this would be stupid. To let it prevent you from any further association with an Asian or Black person is slightly immature, in my opinion. I say slightly because bad experiences vary in gravity and so some reluctance toward future associations can be expected, but also many people tend to overgeneralize about the entire group of people. For example, in my blog I mentioned that an Asian lady at a restaurant was giving my family and I dirty looks. The experience was very hurtful, but am I going to stay away from Asians from now on? No.
But some people do this, especially when it comes to dating. This person did this, so I assume all of those kind of people are like that. This person rejected me, so I feel all of those kind of people will also reject me. I say, grow up and stop overgeneralizing. Would you stop dating males/females because one broke your heart?

Parental Influence - I think this one is pretty much self explanatory. Some people's parents just don't want their children dating someone of some race. And some people do exactly as their parents say. Unfortunately, we must accept this. They key however, is not to overgeneralize and carry that experience to other relationships. BF, if you meet an AM whose parents hate you, don't go thinking every AM's parents are the same. AM, the same goes for you.

Blacks vs. Blacks/Black Families & Relationships - I'm not sure how much validity this has, but I found it in the thread and thought it was interesting. Someone made a point that Asians might be turned off by blacks because of how they interact with other blacks. I won't bring up specific inter-race issues, but someone said something to this affect: "If we cannot love our own race, how can we expect others to do the same?" That make sense to me. Asians have a history of banding together, supporting each other, and doing well as a whole. You don't see many black communities doing that (and if it is out there, it isn't being shown.) We also come from a history of broken families, and aren't doing much to improve upon that. Asians place much value on family, and naturally would look for that quality in a potential mate.
I can see why this might affect how AM look at BF. I wonder if some AM feel this way, and am very interested in any mature feedback on this topic.

Stereotypes - My favorite thing (and by favorite I mean I hate it) about stereotypes is that it's often a one way street. If someone meets a black person who likes fried chicken, they might think, "See, black people DO love fried chicken!" However, if someone meets a black person who doesn't like fried chicken, I think there is a very small chance that they would think, "Hmm, maybe ALL black people DON'T love fried chicken." The original stereotype usually still sticks.
I think there are stereotypes that prevent some Asians and Blacks from being interested in or liking the other. Most people don't even seek out situations in which they can be proven wrong. Instead they think "Blacks are violent"/"Asians are rude" and avoid Blacks/Asians like the plague. So long as we hang on to these stereotypes and don't see conversations or opportunities to test their validity, there will forever be an invisible, and unnecessary, wall between each other.

Some other things I've come up with some friends are:
Dark colors - Dark colors are considered bad luck or unattractive in some Asian cultures.
Assumptions - Assume AM or BF do not like BF or AM. This is a tired excuse, and a cop out in my opinion, that may or may not be related to the things I've talked about above.
AX/WX = Model Couple - Bandwagon mentality.

Someone asked in a post if a lack of seeing AM/BF couples really affects my ability to date AM. Not completely. I recognize that other issues affect whether or not an AM wants to date me. But, at the same time, it's nice to see those couples because it means that there are people who have overcome the issues I've address. It's encouraging. We also often learn by example - if they can do it, I can do it type of thing.

Really, I just want some honest, mature conversation on this. I'm tired of letting assumptions and generalizations and stereotypes dictate how Blacks and Asians communicate, or don't communicate. If we are to make progress, we must clear the air. I hope there are people out there who feel the same.

Originally Posted by ellimac

I understand. I'm not trying to downplay what you went through in your childhood, but I do find it very senseless that black males are so against Asian males. Black males usually like to think of themselves as superior, and what I find absolutely hypocritical and sickening is that black males don't mind dating women of any and every race. They find Asians, especially Japanese exotic, they're fine with white women, they go crazy for Hispanic women, and they're fine with black women. However, the moment someone of another race is with a black woman they flip out! Black males do not own black women and to be honest, I couldn't see myself dating a black guy ANYWAY, so they need to take a few steps back, sit the hell down, and cool it. Not all black females are goo-goo ga-ga over them or find their "swagger" appealing, and the day they let that fact soak into their hard as stone heads, the better off they'll be.

I know that if I had an Asian boyfriend and some skeevy, crusty black guy was making unnecessary remarks, I'd say, "You're not my type anyway!". What the eff. What gives him or anyone of any race the right to tell me who to date? I can be very protective when I'm in a relationship. Black guys need to stop being such hypocrites. It's frustrating because they're (along with other annoying factors) getting in the way of black women being free to be in interracial relationships.

Ugh. Black women and Asian men have so much in common that it's a shame all of this fuckery is going on.

P.S. - I've noticed that a lot of white people also try to discourage AM/BF relationships. Even the white people who themselves date Asians! Where are all of these hypocrites coming from? I don't know who's killing me more: black guys who always have something snide to say, or white people who always have something snide to say. Give me a bloody break. Are black women the only people who are prohibited from dating Asians? Someone needs to get Al Sharpton to investigate this case of bullcrap. XD Hahaha. Al Sharpton. No, but I'm about to explode.

Originally Posted by ellimac

You go, Glenn Coco!

Everything you just said overpowers my last post and sends it into oblivion. Show them what you're working with, boy. Fight for your rights to party. We're not gonna take it! D8< We must stand up against this injustice. Together we shall overcome. All right, on a more serious note -

thank you so, so much for stepping up to the plate and showing your fellow Asian brethren that it's not only society's fault. I personally wouldn't have any qualms walking down the street holding an Asian guy's hand, because I am not the type of person who cares much for the way people gawk or whisper or make rude remarks. If they try to physically assault me or my SO, obviously I'll have a serious issue with that and they'll be cussing about Asian men with black girls from behind bars! But I don't think it would come to physical beating, so I can deal with stares. I've dealt with racism and discrimination all my life and I know many Asian guys have as well, so this shouldn't be some impossible obstacle.

You and your manly man self. :3 See! You know how to make black girls feel good!